xtoshx2: Well, ya know, that would be fine, but we're not on the same system as KR. We get the cards the same way, but we can't trade rares and I've heard we pay more for the cards(and that possibly the odds are lower than in KR). This is a really, really big deal because if you get a rare you don't want instead of a rare you DO want, it is now worthless to you if you don't play the character. If you get a Ceci wedding dress and you don't play Ceci...well, it has no point. It's going to sit there in your inventory and do nothing because you don't like Ceci(and let's face it, almost no one likes ALL the characters). In KR, you can sell it and use the pang to buy, say, Max Elf Ears if you play Max. And this is just one part of it that disproves the whole argument. I don't think it even needs to go beyond this.
Well, ya know, that would be fine, but we're not on the same system as KR. We get the cards the same way, but we can't trade rares and I've heard we pay more for the cards(and that possibly the odds are lower than in KR). This is a really, really big deal because if you get a rare you don't want instead of a rare you DO want, it is now worthless to you if you don't play the character. If you get a Ceci wedding dress and you don't play Ceci...well, it has no point. It's going to sit there in your inventory and do nothing because you don't like Ceci(and let's face it, almost no one likes ALL the characters). In KR, you can sell it and use the pang to buy, say, Max Elf Ears if you play Max. And this is just one part of it that disproves the whole argument. I don't think it even needs to go beyond this.
You think I'm arguing for the system, but you've put words in my mouth here. I never said that the system as "Good" or "Acceptable" or that "This is how it should be" I just said that I expected it to go darn close to what Pangya KR is.
I'm personally somewhere between disatisfied-netural with the current system. While I like the Bonus Cards for my purchases, I don't like the 3 random rares. I personally don't mind having to purchase items for the cards, but I was never exposed to the old system so it's not really a change for me...So..one minor dislike about it. Other than that it's not really earth shattering for me.
Voted: "Community member most likely to be used as example."
Failstar: I'm personally somewhere between disatisfied-netural with the current system. While I like the Bonus Cards for my purchases, I don't like the 3 random rares. I personally don't mind having to purchase items for the cards, but I was never exposed to the old system so it's not really a change for me...So..one minor dislike about it. Other than that it's not really earth shattering for me.
You don't mind having to purchase items because, as you just said, you don't like the 3 rares (although I don't understand why anyone wouldn't like elf ears, since they offer you a huge advantage). But if there was one you really wanted, there's no way you wouldn't run out of items to buy wayyy before you got it unless you were just plain lucky.
Failstar:I'm not disagreeing with you at all.
I apologize, I interpreted your post as disagreeing with me.
Failstar:If people want it changed, you gotta present it in a way that will convince the developers to change it.
I agree with you 100% here, find a solution rather than simply complain, but from what I've seen, we've exhausted any ideas that I could see to argue for the change of the system. Like I said, the basic logic of it should speak for itself, and when you have throw out basic logic and find more complex ideas, it gets frustrating...the simplest solution is most often the correct one.
IGN: HappyGilmore
You will not make this putt... you jack***!
Placed: Failstar: I'm personally somewhere between disatisfied-netural with the current system. While I like the Bonus Cards for my purchases, I don't like the 3 random rares. I personally don't mind having to purchase items for the cards, but I was never exposed to the old system so it's not really a change for me...So..one minor dislike about it. Other than that it's not really earth shattering for me. You don't mind having to purchase items because, as you just said, you don't like the 3 rares (although I don't understand why anyone wouldn't like elf ears, since they offer you a huge advantage). But if there was one you really wanted, there's no way you wouldn't run out of items to buy wayyy before you got it unless you were just plain lucky.
I don't have a deep wallet so I'd probally only spend 10-20 dollars trying to get it. And if I didn't I'd toss my hands up, go "Oh well" and probally find my way into a game of Pangya.
No no, there are things I want from this set (I want the Kooh ears definately)..I just don't like the idea that there are 3 seemingly random grabag rares..I'd like consistancy ;)
Failstar: No no, there are things I want from this set (I want the Kooh ears definately)..I just don't like the idea that there are 3 seemingly random grabag rares..I'd like consistancy ;)
I agree with you there. I don't really understand this 3-random-rare system. It's not to go faster through the old rares either since we're only doing 3 rares instead of 1 set for all 8 chars.
The thing is, with 20 dollars you'd have had a chance before, now, you'd need insane luck.
Failstar: xtoshx2: Well, ya know, that would be fine, but we're not on the same system as KR. We get the cards the same way, but we can't trade rares and I've heard we pay more for the cards(and that possibly the odds are lower than in KR). This is a really, really big deal because if you get a rare you don't want instead of a rare you DO want, it is now worthless to you if you don't play the character. If you get a Ceci wedding dress and you don't play Ceci...well, it has no point. It's going to sit there in your inventory and do nothing because you don't like Ceci(and let's face it, almost no one likes ALL the characters). In KR, you can sell it and use the pang to buy, say, Max Elf Ears if you play Max. And this is just one part of it that disproves the whole argument. I don't think it even needs to go beyond this. You think I'm arguing for the system, but you've put words in my mouth here. I never said that the system as "Good" or "Acceptable" or that "This is how it should be" I just said that I expected it to go darn close to what Pangya KR is. I'm personally somewhere between disatisfied-netural with the current system. While I like the Bonus Cards for my purchases, I don't like the 3 random rares. I personally don't mind having to purchase items for the cards, but I was never exposed to the old system so it's not really a change for me...So..one minor dislike about it. Other than that it's not really earth shattering for me.
The thing I am responding to is quoted here:
Failstar:To me personally, common sense dictated that the system would be wildly similar to PangyaKR (Yes, we're not PangyaKR, but since NtreevSoft Develops the game, and they publish PangyaKR, it's logical to assume we'd get a system darn similar to them with Ntreev being it's sister company)
I never meant to imply that you did consider it "good" or "acceptable", I meant to say that it's just not the same system(which is, indeed, what you were talking about). Both democracy and dictatorship have leaders, but to say that both are "the same kind of system" is, of course, a bit ridiculous. I don't mean to say that just because it's different that it's bad, some differences are very good, but in general, this new system(or rather, these "changes" to the system, if that's too much of a black and white way of seeing it) are large enough and opposed so strongly that I don't think it really works to say such a thing. There's no way I'd call such a system "darn similar" at all. The one major difference is such a big difference that it just changes up everything else within the system.
I'm not trying to put words in your mouth here or any of that, but we've been told the same things repeatedly despite the fact that they have been argued against. I'd like to think everything we say is being heard, but sometimes it feels as though some things just slip by entirely. I don't think I had to make this post, but I felt like if I didn't repeat it, we would have been back where we started when it comes to this particular argument. At least until someone else said it for me. It's not really a matter of agree vs disagree, it's a matter of points which don't seem entirely accurate. I may perceive this differently than you do, and I'm not trying to say you're wrong or put words in your mouth, I'm just voicing my opinion on what you said and that's it.
EDIT: I'm not trying to just whine endlessly. I'm just saying that our argument has already been stated and the argument against it, in my opinion, doesn't seem to work that well, so the old argument still stands. How do we want to change it? Either we want OGP's system so that we can buy cards individually, or if that is an impossible solution, we want to be able to trade rares like we can in Korea so we do have the same system. It can be argued that because we are so different from Koreans in how we do things, it might be better to do it OGP's way and abandon Korea's way for international players, but for now, these are the suggestions for solutions we seem to have to offer.
GMLoki: If you only take away one thing, I would hope everyone can understand that I would never want someone to withold criticism, I just need to ask for the criticism to be constructive. This thread is valuable and I don't want to lock it, but it can't get out of control. It's great that such a majority of our players are so passionate about this update, it really proves they care. If they didn't care and really did plan to quit, we wouldn't be hearing about it with this sort of volume on our forums. So that's good, it's a lot better to hear criticism than silence. In the midst of this passion though, please keep in mind that it's the constructive points that are going to be passed along. Try to avoid antagonistic language wherever possible, let your argument speak for itself and focus on the mechanics. "Just the facts, ma'am" If you say something along the lines of "This is the worst idea ever conceived, whichever idiot thought of it should be fired...out of a cannon into the sun", you know, that feedback probably isn't going to achieve the same effect as it would if it were just worded a little different: "I don't agree with this idea, I think it's inappropriate for our community and instead we should do ______" There's a lot of *that* feedback going around this thread, and that's what we want to collect and pass on.
If you only take away one thing, I would hope everyone can understand that I would never want someone to withold criticism, I just need to ask for the criticism to be constructive. This thread is valuable and I don't want to lock it, but it can't get out of control.
It's great that such a majority of our players are so passionate about this update, it really proves they care. If they didn't care and really did plan to quit, we wouldn't be hearing about it with this sort of volume on our forums. So that's good, it's a lot better to hear criticism than silence.
In the midst of this passion though, please keep in mind that it's the constructive points that are going to be passed along. Try to avoid antagonistic language wherever possible, let your argument speak for itself and focus on the mechanics. "Just the facts, ma'am"
If you say something along the lines of "This is the worst idea ever conceived, whichever idiot thought of it should be fired...out of a cannon into the sun", you know, that feedback probably isn't going to achieve the same effect as it would if it were just worded a little different: "I don't agree with this idea, I think it's inappropriate for our community and instead we should do ______" There's a lot of *that* feedback going around this thread, and that's what we want to collect and pass on.
Ok here you are mine (i already stated, but maybe you'll like in this different way :) )
1) Release ONLY ONE Ecard Rare Item AT TIME (for example SSAF SET);2) Release it for ALL Characters (so there are 8 different rares, except unique ecard items like Rings, Clubset, ecc.);3) TWO (and not only one) ECards every 1000 points BOUGHT (not spent);4) Ecards buyable too for 250 points each;5) Change new Ecard Rare Item every ONE or TWO WEEK (it means 28 ~ 54 different Ecard Sets after only ONE year... you can catch up KR soon in this way);
Discuss.
RegardsCuoReNeRo
~ Italian Legends ~ Guild Leader.
Here's the problems I have:
The #1 problem with trading things as a possible solution is that korea has much less hacking going on.
The #2 problem is a lot of people just want to buy scratchy cards and nothing else here. You can't ask people to just forget they used to be able to, nor can you ask them to stack on more consumables than they'll ever need.
The #3 problem is that ecard packs used to be a great gift to give others (I wouldn't be surprised if this was one of the main things gifted?). This is a big revenue loss for sure.
The final problem (which is something that differs from the KR system) is that you HAVE to spend the points.
CuoReNeRo: GMLoki: If you only take away one thing, I would hope everyone can understand that I would never want someone to withold criticism, I just need to ask for the criticism to be constructive. This thread is valuable and I don't want to lock it, but it can't get out of control. It's great that such a majority of our players are so passionate about this update, it really proves they care. If they didn't care and really did plan to quit, we wouldn't be hearing about it with this sort of volume on our forums. So that's good, it's a lot better to hear criticism than silence. In the midst of this passion though, please keep in mind that it's the constructive points that are going to be passed along. Try to avoid antagonistic language wherever possible, let your argument speak for itself and focus on the mechanics. "Just the facts, ma'am" If you say something along the lines of "This is the worst idea ever conceived, whichever idiot thought of it should be fired...out of a cannon into the sun", you know, that feedback probably isn't going to achieve the same effect as it would if it were just worded a little different: "I don't agree with this idea, I think it's inappropriate for our community and instead we should do ______" There's a lot of *that* feedback going around this thread, and that's what we want to collect and pass on. Ok here you are mine (i already stated, but maybe you'll like in this different way :) ) 1) Release ONLY ONE Ecard Rare Item AT TIME (for example SSAF SET);2) Release it for ALL Characters (so there are 8 different rares, except unique ecard items like Rings, Clubset, ecc.);3) TWO (and not only one) ECards every 1000 points BOUGHT (not spent);4) Ecards buyable too for 500 points each;5) Change new Ecard Rare Item every ONE or TWO WEEK (it means 28 ~ 54 different Ecard Sets after only ONE year... you can catch up KR soon in this way); 6) Change that Papel Shop Rate Discuss. RegardsCuoReNeRo
1) Release ONLY ONE Ecard Rare Item AT TIME (for example SSAF SET);2) Release it for ALL Characters (so there are 8 different rares, except unique ecard items like Rings, Clubset, ecc.);3) TWO (and not only one) ECards every 1000 points BOUGHT (not spent);4) Ecards buyable too for 500 points each;5) Change new Ecard Rare Item every ONE or TWO WEEK (it means 28 ~ 54 different Ecard Sets after only ONE year... you can catch up KR soon in this way);
I'm all for this except I think Ecards should be 250pts same price as A18.
You need to keep in mind that even if rares become tradeable a lot are going to disappear due to hackers buying them and then getting banned. I mean lets face it theres been essentially no progress on actually stopping it so you gotta keep that into account.
It was a typo lol, i mean 250 points each. Edit your post (and my quote please :P)
CuoReNeRo: Ok here you are mine (i already stated, but maybe you'll like in this different way :) ) 1) Release ONLY ONE Ecard Rare Item AT TIME (for example SSAF SET);2) Release it for ALL Characters (so there are 8 different rares, except unique ecard items like Rings, Clubset, ecc.);3) TWO (and not only one) ECards every 1000 points BOUGHT (not spent);4) Ecards buyable too for 500 points each;5) Change new Ecard Rare Item every ONE or TWO WEEK (it means 28 ~ 54 different Ecard Sets after only ONE year... you can catch up KR soon in this way); 6) Change that Papel Shop Rate Discuss. RegardsCuoReNeRo
discussion:
1) yes, whatever they're doing right now is a weird way of possibly ripping people off who only want ears, or only want a wedding dress, etc. please don't do this anymore.
2) all 8, or 4 at a time. maybe 8 to speed things up, but having them in sets of 4 was nice in that it reduced the chances of us getting screwed with characters we don't own.
3) sure, everybody wants more. the problem is, i looked it up and i think they modeled the points system on korea's current cookie/card ratio (UNLIKE AUTOCALIPERS MAY I ADD #@$% ). there isn't really a justification for more.
oh and, we can't ask for bought instead of spent, since ntreev publishes mutiple games. theoretically, someone who mostly plays trickster could just make a pangya account and start cashing in on scratch cards. not really reasonable...
4) buying i think would make ntreev more money. like placed said, when we could buy them for a quarter we could send packs to friends/receive packs, etc. if you looked at ogp transactions, like placed said, probably 75-90% of gifts sent were ecards.
5) a new ecard every two weeks seems okay, maybe a month for the more popular/crucial ones. less time WILL mean we get them faster, but then we'll get to the point where we just have crappy clothes sets left and didn't spend enough time building up a good base of useful items.
i was initially a little angry about the way the system was implemented, and the way the gms were talking to us, but if we do get tradeability it will be more uh, fair.
and change the auto-caliper prices to something reasonable, seriously. other than your pride and reputation as exquisite price setters, you have nothing to lose and customers and their money to gain.
edit: forgot a major point lol
Benimaru420: I'm all for this except I think Ecards should be 250pts same price as A18.
Actually, with his method, you would receive 2 Scratchy cards by recharging 1000 pts, then you can spend that same 1000 pts for 2 more. This would result in 1000 pts being spent, and you having 4 Scratchy cards. Obviously, that would mean you would spend 250 pts a piece per Scratchy card. This would even be better considering if you actually did want to buy something else, you would still get half the Scratchy cards for what you charged.
The only part of what he said that I didn't like was part 5. Since we are talking about money, most people might only be able to afford Scratchy cards at certain intervals. It would be better to have rares cycle after 1 month, that way most people will have enough time to build up the extra cash needed to try and win the rares they want.
As for the comment about them being free, this is completely untrue. I don't know what it will convince you to realise this, but to put it simply, cash has to leave your hands for you to get Scratchy cards in this current system. That means it can be called a bonus, but it is in no way free. Maybe if you had a way to get them without cash, but that isn't the case.
Addition: I would find this more acceptable if we had all the benefits of KR, like getting them when you charge points, and getting them from black papel, and being able to trade/sell rares. Simply put, we do not have those benefits, but rather a POSSIBILITY of getting those benefits. People may be more happy after getting those benefits, but the first thing we see is what is right in front of us, not what MIGHT be in front of us in the future.
tonycheese: oh and, we can't ask for bought instead of spent, since ntreev publishes mutiple games. theoretically, someone who mostly plays trickster could just make a pangya account and start cashing in on scratch cards. not really reasonable...
I realize that but under the current system this IS a problem, that we have to spend points as the only mean of getting cards. If buyable cards were implemented, this wouldn't be a problem.
any form of system will be good for some bad for other, especially for the people who had it one way now its not that way. its ntreev option to have them set the way they are. ( in tha case of losing money.) maybe it was out of their hands, and mothership told them to do it a certain way. either, yeah it could be better , it could be alot worse too. i for one never really bought ecards, ( except the elf ears.) but i do buy monthly items (skins, mascots whatnot) and if i wanted ecards it was a second purchase on top of my other ones. so for me i think this is ok. but i do see how some people would not like it and preferred the way it was, it worked for them, ( except the win rate) which still seems to be an issue to people. 1) i think 1 card for ever 500 points purchased is a great option. 2) i dont think having to spend the points should be there. loki explained it in another thread.3) the item set should be different, all elf ears , for all characters, not 3 different sets. (note maybe it was setup this way to test the waters and get feedback)4)and you should beable to win 1/10 th of a card in game or papel lotto. 10 cards make one scratch ticket.5) certain items should be tradeable or sellable. (when shops, and other issues have been taken care of.( i think the rings, caddies, and the clubs are not tradable or sellable in korea.)
CuoReNeRo: GMLoki: If you only take away one thing, I would hope everyone can understand that I would never want someone to withold criticism, I just need to ask for the criticism to be constructive. This thread is valuable and I don't want to lock it, but it can't get out of control. It's great that such a majority of our players are so passionate about this update, it really proves they care. If they didn't care and really did plan to quit, we wouldn't be hearing about it with this sort of volume on our forums. So that's good, it's a lot better to hear criticism than silence. In the midst of this passion though, please keep in mind that it's the constructive points that are going to be passed along. Try to avoid antagonistic language wherever possible, let your argument speak for itself and focus on the mechanics. "Just the facts, ma'am" If you say something along the lines of "This is the worst idea ever conceived, whichever idiot thought of it should be fired...out of a cannon into the sun", you know, that feedback probably isn't going to achieve the same effect as it would if it were just worded a little different: "I don't agree with this idea, I think it's inappropriate for our community and instead we should do ______" There's a lot of *that* feedback going around this thread, and that's what we want to collect and pass on. Ok here you are mine (i already stated, but maybe you'll like in this different way :) ) 1) Release ONLY ONE Ecard Rare Item AT TIME (for example SSAF SET);2) Release it for ALL Characters (so there are 8 different rares, except unique ecard items like Rings, Clubset, ecc.);3) TWO (and not only one) ECards every 1000 points BOUGHT (not spent);4) Ecards buyable too for 250 points each;5) Change new Ecard Rare Item every ONE or TWO WEEK (it means 28 ~ 54 different Ecard Sets after only ONE year... you can catch up KR soon in this way); 6) Change that Papel Shop Rate Discuss. RegardsCuoReNeRo
Just a suggestion to 3)instead of getting two, you should only get one when you spend recharge 1k points
and 4)althought an e-card for 250 points would seem great, it would be unreasonable to the company, so 500pts per one is probably the senario if this were to follow out
now with these modifications
the ONE e-card earned per every 1k point CHARGED really acts like a bonus and they won't lose profit by giving about 1k for getting 1k they sell.
hope this made sense?
Character: Unknown
WHOO! -400 reached!